Home
entries friends calendar user info Previous Previous Next Next
lady_nara -
lady_nara
[info]lady_nara
Add to Memories
Tell a Friend
 

As part of my search for The Real Kagetora, I think I will occasionally post random little things I think I have discovered about Kagetora. 

Today's thought: Kagetora= Not a cocktease.


All things considered, Kagetora is remarkably not a cocktease. Now, I will tack on the disclaimer that I have not had access to all of the canon, and it would be very easy for me to miss something, therefore. But from everything I HAVE seen, there is nowhere (before book 20, anyway) the slightest hint of Kagetora deliberately attempting to be seductive. Nowhere! Nor is there anything to suggest that he behaved otherwise before his Takaya possession. The man is fundamentally uncomfortable with sex, and understandably so. He endured a horrific gang rape at a young age. Apparently he didn’t even like having sex with his first wife. He did, to fulfill his duty of begetting an heir, but he felt “dirty.” After that, the only other hint we have that he may have had an intimate relationship with someone is Minako. And we’re never told whether he actually slept with her. One might wonder, for instance, how he immediately knew that Minako’s child was not his? Personally, I am inclined to think that he did sleep with her, if only because there are some mentions made of him reclining on her “motherly” bosom, a description which kind of made me go o.O Okay, so Minako was motherly to him, and he views Naoe as a father figure (at least at first)? Yeesh.  But I digress.

Yes, he might have slept with Minako, but that was obviously a serious relationship. In the Takaya possession, he never dated or had a girlfriend, though according to Saori “lots” of girls probably liked him. In the manga based on 5.5, we see girls hitting on him and his disinterested dismissal. Mitsui notes that Takaya seems uncomfortable with sex, and makes fun of him for it. Mitsui hits on him (very creepily), and Takaya responds by slamming him in the gut so hard he flies across the room. When Naoe reveals to Takaya that he has a penchant for one-night stands, he notices that Takaya seems weirded out by the thought, and chalks it up to “a prudish streak” or just immaturity.

My point in all this should be clear, as I’ve repeated it half a dozen times: Kagetora is very uncomfortable with sex. He does not behave in a sexual manner except within the context of a serious relationship (so far as we know, and I think that’s a reasonable assumption), and those are few and far between.

 The one who uses sex as a weapon in their relationship is Naoe. Whenever he wants to get a rise out of Kagetora, Naoe either molests him or says something sexual to him (or both). Why? Because he knows it bothers him. Sex is about the only area where Naoe has the upper hand, and he knows it, though he doesn't know why. 

Kagetora never says or does anything to Naoe that could be construed as sexual in nature unless he is forced,  protesting what is happening, or referring to their win/lose thing (and only then in a very vague way). The closest Kagetora ever comes to voluntarily bringing up the subject with Naoe is when he uses what Naoe said earlier to try and keep him interested in their win/lose thing: “If you beat me, then you can hold me.” That bet is referred to multiple times, later.

The impression I got from that whole thing was that this was something new, a gauntlet that Kagetora had tossed down in sheer desperation to keep Naoe from giving up and leaving. It seems, from other places in the novels, that both Kagetora and Naoe think that Kagetora going to bed with Naoe would signal that he had lost/surrendered. So, really, it isn’t as though Kagetora is saying anything new, so much as rephrasing it to slap Naoe in the face with some of his own dirty talk (with the really bad bits cut out).  So I interpret it as more like he’s saying “You haven’t beaten me yet, bastard. You’ll just have to keep trying.” Oh, and he does say one other “sexual”  thing- during a fight, he makes the comment, “sleeping around doesn’t make it any better, does it?” Which is pretty nasty, but not exactly a come-on.  And again, nowhere near the direct dirty talk that Naoe uses to freak Kagetora out.

Otherwise, he barely even acknowledges that Naoe wants him that way- he tends to think of Naoe’s feelings towards him  (and everyone else’s) in a non-sexual light, even when it’s reached the point where you’re wondering how dense he can possibly be. Example: Naoe’s first come-on to Takaya. In the novels, he forcibly kisses him. Takaya’s reaction: why does he hate me? What did he want to do to me? Um….Takaya, dude. What do you think he wanted to do to you?!  “Immature” or not, you’re a high schooler in a country where kids your age and younger are highly sexualized. And, y’know, he kissed you. Shouldn’t that be a dead giveaway?

But the thought that someone would be attracted to him does not easily enter Kagetora’s mind. Sure, he notices that people are hitting on him (sometimes) but it seems like he usually thinks that they’re just trying to dominate him, not actually finding him attractive (the fact that the desire to dominate him usually DOES combine with attraction toward him aggravates the problem). Kagetora does not view himself as a desirable person. And when people come on to him, it isn't because he does anything in particular to attract or encourage their interest, and he frequently is not aware that they even have any.  It's just that Kagetora has some kind of animal magnetism, an immense sex appeal that he has no control over and seems to be completely unaware of.

Consider: when Kaizaki-Naoe has him handcuffed naked and drugged to a bed, and takes the opportunity to molest him quite thoroughly, Kagetora's first theory as to why this occurs is pity. He thinks it was a pity fuck! Dude. What makes it really ridiculous is that this took place after that other guy had come in and tried to molest him immediately prior to Kaizaki's entrance. And then Kaizaki had started flirting with him right off the bat, before Kagetora became upset. Good grief, he still thinks it's pity even when Kaizaki comes and meets him much later on and gropes him. How clueless can you be?

Kagetora: I don’t want your damn pity!
Kaizaki: Oh, come on. You can't honestly think that’s all it is.
Kagetora (thinking FURIOUSLY): ? Well, come to think of it, he was pretty rough with me, which wouldn't make much sense if he was just trying to be comforting.
Kagetora:...
Kagetora: (surprised): He wanted me. Right?

Give the man a prize.

Kagetora doesn’t really think that Naoe finds him desirable, either. He thinks that Naoe just wants to "conquer" him, that it's all some domination game to him. And when it's over, Naoe will just get bored and wander off. Which is why he refuses to give in to Naoe in the first place. Putting sexual intimacy issues and personal dislike of being used/subjugated aside, Kagetora won't allow himself to give in to his feelings toward Naoe because he thinks the minute he does, Naoe will be off to the races. Even if Naoe actually does love and want him, the real him, which Kagetora HIGHLY doubts, he considers any love which he might inspire to be insufficient to have kept the man by his side all this time. Really, it must all be about Naoe's ego. Naoe wants to win. When he does, the game will be over and he will leave. Kagetora can't stand the thought of losing Naoe, so he plays along. He may have other reasons for doing so, as well, but his primary motivation is keeping Naoe with him.

Conclusion: Kagetora does not cocktease. There is no real evidence of him doing so, and it is highly unlikely given what we know of his character and past that he would. Kagetora is extremely uncomfortable with sex. He doesn’t think of himself as desirable, either, which would mean that it probably wouldn’t occur to him to use his sex appeal to his advantage. Within the context of the Naoe/Kagetora dynamic, it is primarily Naoe who uses sexuality as a weapon.

Tags: ,

Comments
labingi From: [info]labingi Date: April 13th, 2008 01:26 am (UTC) (Link)
Excellent essay! I am nodding in agreement. Just to add a couple thoughts:

Yes, Kagetora is thoroughly unaware of his own attractiveness, and this probably a large part of what makes him so attractive. No one looks less sexually desperate (and hence more desirable) than someone who isn't making any come-ons at all but is disingenuously his gorgeous self.

Yes, too, Kagetora strongly identifies sex with domination. This is, no doubt, linked to his rape. His foundational sexual experience emphasized domination much more than basic attraction, and he's always carried that with him.

I agree with you that Naoe deploys sex as a weapon, at least in part, because he knows it bugs Takaya. But I think this is mostly instinctive for him--or at least not part of a rational strategy. He learns--like, um, a dog would--that when he behaves a certain way, he gets Takaya's goat, and so he naturally behaves that way when he wants to unsettle Takaya. I think it's largely a question of psychological conditioning. Plus, he really does want Kagetora, and he really has for a long time. By this point, it's just busting out a bit.
lady_nara From: [info]lady_nara Date: April 13th, 2008 02:58 am (UTC) (Link)
Kagetora is thoroughly unaware of his own attractiveness, and this probably a large part of what makes him so attractive.

Absolutely! This is also part of what makes him seem so obnoxious to Nagahide, I think.

His foundational sexual experience emphasized domination much more than basic attraction, and he's always carried that with him.

Yes, indeed. When I read his memory of the rape via google translation, I noticed that it was emphasized that his rapists really got off on the fact that this was their master they were violating. Ick.

I also think that Kagetora has such a low opinion of himself that the idea of people being attracted to him for a reason other than the more abstract desire to subjugate him is strange to him. He seems to automatically distrust any positive reaction to himself (which he notices) as being a matter of either deception or error.

You're probably right about Naoe not using sex as a weapon as part of some overall, thought-out strategy. He doesn't seem to realize exactly how much it bothers him, of course. He may simply think that it is humiliating for Kagetora to hear himself being referred to in this crude manner, or to be forcibly touched in this way by another man, an inferior, no less.

And he does want Kagetora very much! Sometimes his jabs seem calculated, but they aren't always, and even when they are, they don't usually stay that way. When he kissed Kagetora, that was a spur of the moment impulse, not a planned attack. When he groped him during the first hotel scene, he was pretty carried away by his desire and frustration. But at the same time, it was written that he was deliberately choosing his words at that moment, not because he necessarily felt them, but to hurt Kagetora. Although, again, even if he started out with some control, he didn't keep it for long. His aggressiveness toward the end of that scene had less to do with any intelligible line of reasoning and much more with simply being unable to contain himself, I would wager.

labingi From: [info]labingi Date: April 13th, 2008 01:50 pm (UTC) (Link)
He seems to automatically distrust any positive reaction to himself (which he notices) as being a matter of either deception or error.

That's a very good observation and a sign of how thoroughly he's felt abandoned/betrayed in his past by the people who should be supporting him: fathers, teachers, brothers, Takaya's mother, etc. He's developed a default distrust of any interaction that appears positive. Poor guy!
From: [info]meganinhiding Date: April 14th, 2008 06:25 pm (UTC) (Link)
Excellent post! Some people don't know their own strength; Kagetora doesn't know his own appeal, sexual or otherwise. I agree that Kagetora's not a cocktease unless you think not jumping into bed with Naoe for 400 years makes him a cocktease.

The problem with Kagetora thinking that Naoe's interest is due to ego is that its partly accurate and noone else seems to notice this about Naoe except Irobe. Aside from his fears over abandonment there are valid reasons for Kagetora to not give in to Naoe; if he had bent over like a good little uke sometime in the past 400 years their relationship would still have been dysfunctional and might have even hit the boiling point sooner.

You mention in your reply to labing about reading a google translation of his memories of his rape. Could you direct me to this? The only google translations of Mirage that I know of are Karura's fanfic.

One last thing; Asphodel has a translation of the prologue to Volume Five up on her site; its the dream sequence from episode 7.
lady_nara From: [info]lady_nara Date: April 15th, 2008 06:31 pm (UTC) (Link)
The problem with Kagetora thinking that Naoe's interest is due to ego is that its partly accurate and noone else seems to notice this about Naoe except Irobe.

That is a very good point. It is true- the others don't seem to understand that side of Naoe. I didn't know that Irobe was aware of it, though. That's terribly interesting. Is there a particular place you're drawing this from?

if he had bent over like a good little uke sometime in the past 400 years their relationship would still have been dysfunctional and might have even hit the boiling point sooner.

I couldn't agree more! Many people seem to follow Nagahide's line of thinking that if Kagetora would just shut up and bend over, everything would be hunky-dory. Hahaha. No. Because both of them would still have their gigantic issues, only everything would be that much more complicated and painful. I think probably that both of them would hate themselves and each other even more, and their blow-ups would be a heckuva lot more violent. Thank goodness Kuwabara-sensei doesn't let them hook up until the most important problems have been worked through!

As for Kagetora's rape memory, I was referring to the english translation of kat_tyan's russian translations of the Watsudami arc. I made a post about how to access these a little while ago on this lj, and crossposted it to mirage_trans. Come to think of it, I believe I was using babelfish, not google, to translate.
The rape memory is in chapter 7 of "The Empress of Coastal Waters" part I.

Thanks so much for the info! I scampered off to read it immediately :D

From: [info]meganinhiding Date: April 16th, 2008 02:51 am (UTC) (Link)
Back in March quaint_twilight made a post to vent some frustration with Irobe's attitude toward's Naoe and Kagetora's relationship; namely that they should just give up on it. One of the reasons she sited was Naoe's feelings of inferiority regarding Kagetora. I haven't seen this perceptiveness among Haruie and Nagahide who, as far as I can tell, chalk up Naoe's angst to unrequited love.

In Exaudi Nos when Naoe visits Irobe in the hospital he speeks with Naoe like I imagine a therapist would and I think its mentioned that he did what he could to counsel and support Naoe post-Minako. Incidentally I'm speaking entirely of Naoe's winner/loser complex; not the attempted assaults which I think only Kotaro is aware of due to having stopped one of them.

Ah, I thought you might be referring to kat_tyan's translation which unfortunately did not have a google translation; it was indeed babelfish.

I'm glad too that Kuwabara dealt with their issues first; because if Naoe was that rough with Kagetora in vol. 20 imagine if he still felt a need to conquer/subjugate him.
6 comments or Leave a comment
profile
lady_nara
User: [info]lady_nara
Name: lady_nara
calendar
Back June 2008
1234567
891011121314
15161718192021
22232425262728
2930
page summary
tags

Advertisement

Customize